Planning Board - September 8, 2026

I would like to open the Tuesday, September 8th plan board meeting. It is uh 4:03. And please join me in the pledge of allegiance. I pledge algiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands. One nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

Under Mass General Law, chapter 38, section 20F, this meeting was being recorded and broadcast live on YouTube.

Uh first up is uh key action items and um the first one is uh 519 American Legion Highway file number 26-5247 SBA-miner request by applicant to approve a minor modification to site plan approval for the addition of a firearms manufacturing license for property located at 519 American Legion Highway, Map 66, lot 18B.

Good afternoon to the board attorney Mong on behalf of the applicant. I'm also the uh co-owner and manager of Firearm Fanatics LLC, which is the um corporation that would be doing business at the proposed location, which also happens to be my law office. um give you a basic overview of this. So, first of all, it's considered a minor site plan review. Michael and I had gone back and

forth and kind of figured this made the most sense under the town bylaws because this classifies as a light manufacturing that requires both site planner review from the planning board and special permit from the ZBA. So, I'm on the agenda with the ZBA for October 14th.

That would be like the second phase of this. Um, but there's no changes happening to the site plan. It's we basically just had Sean Leech of Northeast create an existing conditions plan. Um, this is the condo uh commercial condo association that my dad did in 2005 and really nothing has changed since then. Um, we just show the parking and the traffic flow and whatnot. Um, a little bit about the

business. It's by appointment only and the license type is considered a manufacturer's license. That is a broad term. We aren't going to be creating firearms from like a raw material.

There's no factory here. It's a law firm. Um the purpose for using this address is it is my law office and we find it to be a safe location uh to operate and do business out of the um ATF was willing to issue the license already and then when we kind of came back Ralph had originally said he didn't think that this fell under the category and then Michael and I talked and

decided that it probably made more sense to go forward under the bylaw with it this way. Um, so it does meet the characteristics.

Essentially, what happens is the second you take a firearm apart, if you take the slide off or you disassemble it in any way, shape, or form when you're in the possession of somebody else's firearm, you're technically considered a manufacturer under the federal law. And so the other two or three FFLs, which are federal firearm licences in the town, are retail stores. So they're like, you know, typical like you're

familiar with shooting supply on Route 6 and uh Village Sports. Those are, you know, your traditional brick-andmortar firearm location. You walk in, you buy a gun, do the background check, all of that. We're more of like a buy appointment only. If you wanted to have like some custom work done, we can send it out and have other companies like do the work and then they send it back to

us and we just put it back together. Um, so there's no like real manufacturing happening per se. It's just defined as manufacturing. And because of that, the approval is required um of the site plan. Uh but I'll just give you the basics. If you're familiar with the property, the stoages are back here.

Mckey Court runs over here and these are the office condos. My office sits in the first building right off of 177. Um and there's public parking all throughout.

This side is typically used for employees. We park uh public on this side. And there are ADA handicap access ramps at both ends of the um porches and it's all on the first story that would be happening there. Um traffic flows in one way and back out to 177. We won't be doing any signage. This is really more of like a a hobby thing for us. Um you know it's by appointment

only, but it's not. You all know I'm a attorney by trade and I'm typically doing this stuff for clients. So, this is more of something that my cousin and I are interested in and just want to do on the side. And because of the fact that it's firearms, there's quite a bit of licensing that goes along with it, which, you know, is what brings us here today.

Okay, Michael.

Um, as Mag had said, this is moving an appointment only retail use into an existing commercial space as is. Um, they're not going to make any modifications to the site. So, I'd recommend approval of the request without conditions.

Okay. the the the main thing that I'd be u questioning and I don't know I haven't read about this yet is uh is this in the table of use is is is that why you're calling it manu light manufacturing because light manufacturing is in the table of use yes yes it is yeah light manufacturing basically when you look at the definition and the bylaws we fall under that it's like a general term there's like specific

manufacturing. Um, I don't have the bylaws in front of me, but when we did the research, talked with Ralph, talked with Mike, we kind of went through it and came up with light manufacturing was really what suited the definition of what our business would classify as. And so, under the town bylaws, light manufacturing requires a special permit and a site plan review.

Okay. So it's so so we're we're squeezing this into the table of use by choosing something that you think it would be or do we have do we have some case law or anything that points that what you're doing is light manufacturing?

I mean I just like to know how we got to light manufacturing for this kind of use.

Light industry is defined as fabrication, assembly, processing, finishing work or packaging in such a manner that noise, dust, odor, vibration or similar objectionable features are confined to the premises and are in no way objectionable to the abuing property.

And this was in consultation with Ralph because we don't make a determination on whether or not the land use is is allowed or not. That's the perview of the building commissioner. But with his guidance, we determined this is a use that Ralph would see as requiring site plan review under the zoning bylaw.

So, we're looking at, you know, the the how the site functions versus the land use itself.

In that regard, Mr. Chairman, I think, you know, looking at this this by appointment use doesn't alter parking requirements or traffic requirements, the things that we would we if this this were if this wasn't fitting in the existing building, the things that we would look at if this was a new building, the things that we would look at, I I think this by appointment use probably has no effect on traffic and

and and parking.

I would agree with that. I mean, I my my stepgrandfather was a owned a gun was a was a gunsmith and owned a gun shop in Pennsylvania. Um, so I understand exactly what you're trying to accomplish by appointment only and modifications.

So, he had an FFL license as well. So, I understand the process you're going through trying to do this. And you're you know when you said you have ATF license in hand already and some of these other things I you know this is not the first point of clarification. We don't have a license in hand yet but they yes everything's filed and they're willing to issue it bearing the approval by the town.

So the other two locations that have ATF license licenses they're approved in our table of use for retail or Yeah. Well, they're a different type of license. So, under their license type, they're only required to be zoned in a business district. So, which we only have the business district. So, we're in the same district, per se. It's just that they're they're 01 and we're 07 FFL. That's the difference between the

two. So, the type 01 allows you to buy and sell and that's it. You're not allowed to dismantle or take apart or do any service work, anything like that.

The 07 is what allows you to do the dismantling and whatnot, which is why it then falls under the category of manufacturing.

So, they're not allowed to take apart.

Not to the extent that we will be able to. I mean, I think that they can take the slides off of like handguns and things like that.

It would depend. It would depend on their specific license number. I know that some are retail only by sale purposes and they can remove a slide or basically make the weapon safe for shipment if they're allowed to do that. Some are allowed to some licensers have gun smithing is included whereas you're able to dismantle and do on-site repairs.

As far as I'm aware, both village and shooting supplier are strictly L1 where their sales meaning retail.

Meaning retail. Yes, exactly.

And you I think this is in a a commercial district, is it?

Oh, yeah. Same exact district as shooting supply.

So, any more questions?

Want a motion, Mr. Chair?

No, it's it's a public hearing, right?

No, it's not a public hearing.

Not a public hearing.

Is there anybody here for this?

No.

Okay. Then I would entertain a motion.

Uh, Mr. Chair, I uh move to approve the minor modification to site plan approval for 519 American Legion Highway to allow the addition of a firearms manufacturers's license.

Second.

Any comments, changes? All those in favor?

I.

Thank you.

Uh point of climate for the money held in Estro, does that have to go back before them at a later meeting to get released or No, we can release that.

Could Could we would the board also entertain a motion to release the uh consultant review fees as well?

So move.

Awesome.

Thank you guys.

Is there a second?

Second.

And uh has there been any expenditures for it?

No.

Okay.

All those in favor? I thank you the board. Have a great night.

See you later.

Uh, next would be planner support.

Yeah. One second.

All right. So, I think you all know that we have a couple of different projects going on at the head of Westport. We have the village center zoning, which is not solely a head of Westport project, but it involves the head of Westport. up. Um the mass DOT local early actionable planning for traffic calming on Old County Road um which I have some plans.

I have some plans we can go over um in a bit here. But then we also received funding for the municipal vulnerability preparedness program to study the contributors to flood dynamics at the head of Westport which would include storm water analysis analysis of the title influence and storm surge. Um and so these are three different they're three different on the surface level pretty different

initiatives but they're they all kind of build on one another. So the the zoning piece if you want to and part of the goal of this project is to introduce um more context depending zoning in Westport's village centers. So looking at um you know right sizing the lot sizes in some of these areas and allowing some very limited commercial uses um and other maybe uses that the community may desire in these areas um

so they can be more accommodating of um the commercial businesses in those areas. And um so in order to have a a district that is appropriate for commercial uses, you also need to make sure that the traffic flow through the area is um you know it's for it's safe for people to go out and patronize those businesses. And so one thing we started looking at, and this was after a couple years of

receiving complaints on Old County Road as well, um was to see where we can get funding for doing some traffic calming in the area. And I applied to the Mass DOT LEAP program. Um and the town was selected for that. and we worked with TEC Engineering to develop a conceptual plan for traffic calming on Old County Road. And so the way this would work is that the traffic calming would be installed with a series of speed

cushions with reflective tape. Um there would be a slower speed limit and signage installed through the corridor.

And the it would start near the high school and at right before the first entrance to the high school. And as you move towards the the curve there in Old County Road, there would be a another set of speed humps before the next before the library driveway. There would not be any around the curve.

But then as you get around the curve of Old County Road, there would be another set of speed cushions right as you get down to the trough of the hill. Um then there would be another set on the opposite side of Old County Road as you get across the bridge and cross the intersection with Reed Road. And so the point of this is to try to get motorists to go a to physically

encourage them to reduce their speeds, but also to visually signal to motorists that they need to reduce their speeds with signage and striping and the speed cushions. and um it will signal to drivers that they're entering a corridor that there's going to be more vulnerable users on the roadway.

What do you say speed cushion? That seems to be a very polite way to say speed bump.

Uh well, they're not a speed bump exactly. So table, right?

They're they're not a table either. The they're a kind of a hybrid between the two. And the reason why they're going to be deployed this way, and I'll bring up I'm working on bringing up an an image right now, but um it's to allow easy passage of a fire truck. So, with these speed pillows, there a fire truck chassis is wide enough that when you space it, the truck can get through um

without having to slow down. But the width of a typical um vehicle would eat have one tire hit one side of the speed cushion. So, let me pull up the photo for you. Um these are used in some local communities. I've talked to the fire department about it and they're they said as long as they can get a a truck over one of these, they're they're fine. And the fire chief has um you know

referred him to I I know that they're used in Providence and so he's seen them in Providence and seen how they work. So um are they like the ones that are near the entrance to 195 near east India Point Park.

Yeah.

Yeah. Not nearly as dramatic as those are very those are surprising.

Yes. These are the these this is the actual spec sheet from the ones that would be deployed here. Um can't really see what it says, but does it give you a dimension?

Yeah.

How how do they adhere to the road like they're bolted in to the road?

Bolted in.

Yeah.

So they can be removed for snow plowing during winter months and things. you destroy them in your first season of having them.

And these are all modular temporary installations.

So you remove them before snow plowing?

Yeah, we would pull them out before snow plowing so that you wouldn't basically cut them out with a plow or destroy a plow in the process.

Right. Exactly. Um they're meant to be temporary. These are not permanent installations through the area, but we want to come in with a design to see what works in this corridor.

And if this doesn't work, then we can toss the design and go back to the drawing board with something else.

Um, so so [clears throat] the way that the fire truck would go through, just like any other big truck, Mhm.

they go through the spaces in between, right? So they don't have to go over them, right?

But a car or a pickup truck can't.

Yeah. You'll hit you'll end up on one one side. Yeah. If you try to avoid them because your vehicle is more narrow.

I have a question.

Uh how about an ambulance?

Ambulance would be on same size as a same size as a fire truck.

Yeah.

Yeah. All right. Okay. I'm just I'm just saying that a smaller vehicle that's why I Right. Right. Yeah.

But a 10 wheel Mhm.

is going to hit one of them.

Right.

That's why I say that.

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, they're going to be temporary in nature, too. So if something isn't working out, you know, the fire department once they have to respond to an emergency situation and they go out and they look at them and have to drive over them and they're not installed quite the right way or whatever the situation may be, we can pull them out as necessary. So that way it's not, you know, we're not going in

and putting down a piece of asphalt that we're going to have to dig up the road to replace.

Um, so the the point behind this is to get them installed. It's going to be temporary. We'll assess whether or not it's an effective way of reducing the speeds through Old County Road. Then they could be, you know, something that we could make permanent in the future.

It's something that Mass DOT would fund the acquisition of the materials. the town would have to town's highway department would have to install these and then remove them each season.

Another reason why we wanted to do this as a pilot is because with the MVP study that we're doing, there's a storm water component to it and we don't want to start making modifications to the roadway if 3 4 years down the line there may need to be storm water upgrades and then you spend, you know, however many hundreds of thousands of dollars and tearing up the road and inconveniencing

people is to have to go in there and tear it up and then put down the same work all over again, right? You don't want to do it twice.

Mr.

U, I think this is a good idea. It's probably not as effective at slowing down traffic as having Eversource come and bury electric cables the way we're doing the traffic calming on Hicks Bridge. But um but it's still going to be effective. Uh my question is not so much on this um although I can see how removing it, you know, sometime in the fall and putting it back in the spring

may turn into a headache. But um in the vulnerability um are we looking at the dam that supplies or restrains water from the east branch by Route 6?

Yes, we are.

That'll be factored into the analysis that we're doing. We're not going to look at the removal of it. No, but the condition but the Yeah, that's because that would be one of the inputs into the whole system wider system.

So all the dams are listed on a state website.

Mhm.

But to get real information out of that is is at least for me impossible.

List them all is you know um potentially a problem.

Mhm. all the bands. I mean almost all the in in the in the complexity of the um the the dam at Route Six is that when when the highway the highway used to have a much sharper angle at the Dartmouth line and I [clears throat] think it was in the 30s is when when that the curve that that's now there that that swung by Lincoln Park when that curve came in it

it incorporated the u the eastern end of the dam inside the highway layout.

So the highway actually sits on part of the dam park.

Great. Great.

the the spillway that you see and the the pumping station that used to pump into the aqueduct that was in Route 6, that's just just outside of the right of way. But when the way they they did the curve, the the the f the fill section for the new bridge and all of that was built back in the 30s. that end that eastern end of the dam is in the highway.

So is there another dam further up?

Yes. Free town or sometimes there there is a small um dam that's part of the um Lake Nok.

Mhm.

And it's it's at a higher elevation, but it the discharge from that is into the lower part of the lake.

Right. And then and then it sees the dam and the spillway that's right at Route Six.

But there's nothing further north.

No, that the river is after that. The shingle river comes in and all of those things come in. Um that there is the big Copicut reservoir which is in our watershed, but it's not on the east branch. It's on It's on the Copicott River that was that was damned.

And where does that go?

Um into darkness.

That that No, that comes down I think in feeds the release feeds into I think bread and cheese.

And there's an old dam up there.

That's a big dam.

Big dam.

And that's that's that's not neither of those dams are in well part of part of the the town line runs through the Route Six dam and the Copa Cut is actually in Fall River I think or Lakeville or Freetown River.

Right. But if it fails that doesn't mean the water's not coming.

No.

It comes in that direction.

Okay.

Sorry to interrupt you.

No, that's okay. I can talk about the mass trails grant now if you would like to move on. Um this is quick update. We just contracted with PAR to continue the design of the uh with connector. So that's this small segment that just um runs along the abandoned rail bed um right at the the border of Route Six with Fall River and it stops at Old Bedford Road. We're still intending on

designing that as a boardwalk. So um we're meeting with Mass DOT on Friday to talk about that. So and that would be on the northern edge of the pond.

The northern edge of the pond. Yeah. Um so hope hopefully they look favorably towards the boardwalk design. I mean that does increase the cost considerably but the town does not have any public access to southwest pond at this time.

Um, and this is only the only means to get across into Fall River in a at least, you know, not very uh in a way that's a direct way to get from Westport to Fall River on the um South Coast bike way. So going all the way around North.

So the boardwalk is part will be part of the bikeway.

Yes. But will it be the bike way or will that be also public access to walk on the look at the pond and stuff?

It will be the bike way. I don't know what the design is going to look like because where the last iteration of the project left off was the assumption that it was going to be a standard asphalt bikeway. But due to the public engagement proceedings, we were encouraged to look at the boardwalk option. So the design specifications remain to be seen at this time. We haven't kicked off the design process yet.

So the people doing this understand that there was public access along there in the past and there were public you could go rent a a rowboat from there and row out onto the pond and go skating on the pond and stuff like that.

back in the day when the Charlie first came into Okay.

being so that people from Fall River could come out to the country and do that.

Gotcha. Interesting.

I have a question on public engagement.

I happened to be doing some doortodoor uh before the primary in that neighborhood and saw an awful lot of signs in opposition to the what I think is the uh bikeway or boardwalk.

Um what's your sense of of public feeling about this? the board, the Wataba connector doesn't cross anyone's property. Uh well, and I will say that the Northern Scenic Greenway runs along people's property. For the most part, it is intended to be within the road right of way, adjacent to people's property.

Now, there may be some constraints where takings are necessary in order to um have an adequate design. This one, it's right behind some industrial properties.

The Lef France Corporations very supportive of it. Um, it's also a pretty small project area. So, I think the the contexts are just really different here.

Okay. Thanks.

So, you folks back there, are you here for this particular thing? If you'd like to come up closer and and should you have a question, now is the time to ask.

Well, my thing is I will eventually throw you to get to the corner.

If you want, could you come to the microphone please?

So that people at home hear what you're um as far as could you identify yourself?

Oh, my name is Maryanne Lloyd. I'm an executive group. Okay. Um but co coming in the different plans I've seen um the over like the the offramp is horrible. I walk I walk that every day just about the offramp no one stops. I mean it's it's just it's a dangerous road from from the from 195 east east. Yeah.

Um the corner like after the overpasses the corner is a dangerous corner. There is accidents there quite often. You can check with the police department. Plus that part of Old Bedford Road was the suburbs of Fall River in days of York. A lot of the lots are very small.

Mhm.

Their wells are not too they're what 8 ft 10 ft off the road. So if you're taking a piece of that, what do they do with their wells? And they have lots of small. So they probably don't have any place to move them to because of footage or whatever. Plus, who pays to move their wells? I mean, you know, I don't know if anybody has septic in the front of their house. I think it's mostly

wells, but I mean, who is going to, you know, I mean, you've got a quite a few historical 200 plus year old houses, walls, broad iron fences. I mean, you're going to destroy that. I mean it it's there's just a lot of you know you've got a lot of farmland you've got a lot of like irrigation wells Samson's has y you know could could you describe for me anyway exactly where in old Bedford you were

talking about um well right when you between like the overpass and like Blossom Road that's the narrower part they never widened it um in what was that in the 80s number mid70s. They they didn't widen it just basically because of the walls and everything that they would have to move.

So, it's a narrower road.

This is just east of Blossom.

West of Blossom between the between like the offramp and Blossom Road. Yeah.

So, that piece of that um Yeah. right spread over right around here.

But it's it's narrower and it it widens up a little bit. But the problem, one of the biggest problems that was an old back road. When I was a kid, it was a back road. You knew everybody that drove by a house. But now you have with the birth of GPS and the daily accidents on 195 and Route 6, GPS sends everybody that way.

Really?

Oh, yeah. And that now people have found you can go to fall from Fall River to New Bedford with three stop signs and they they are using it. We've got trash the big trash trucks come through.

Really?

Yeah. Because you don't have to they don't get them on the back roads. So I mean you've got construction vehicles. I mean it it's it's become a very dangerous road on top of everything else. But just looking at people's properties of what how much you're going to take from them. they have small properties and you you're going to cut that much out of their their property values, you know.

Yeah. [snorts] Yeah. I mean, I I can't say for certain the extent to which takings may be necessary. I think the approach that the project team is taking is to leave the infrastructure in the road layout to the greatest extent possible. I don't know.

We're not in the design phase yet. So, I don't know where those pinch points are going to end up. Um, I will say that when the town has to do takings like that, it is that the town has to pay a fair market value uh of that property.

They have to get it assessed and um go through the whole legal process of initiating that takings. But um I think part of what is attractive about this route is that it's very idyllic and has those features that everyone loves about this part of the state which is you know the stone walls and the countryside.

You're going to take this all down.

That's the thing is when you do it all this stuff is going to disappear. all these gorgeous trees are going to get cut down and it's you know you're you're wiping out the beauty of the whole the whole thing and then once you get into darkness the roads are all windy and I mean there's been quite a few deaths recently on that road just because people are flying they do not they do not slow down

so I mean I have motorcycles going by my house doing 80 miles an hour so and and ebikes those are fun So this road intersects with the font road in Dartmouth if you Yeah. If you keep following that road, it'll take you to New Bedford.

It'll take you right like where 140 is.

The high you'll go by Yeah. the New Bedford airport.

So So people have figured out that you can do that with three stops on it. It was probably the way to get from Fall River into Bedford before that was the what the New Bedford. No.

Twilight turn. They used that used to be a turnpike. I guess that was it.

Oh, but it was it was like a pain back and forth.

Yeah.

So, Michael is is um I haven't paid enough attention to the bikeway details, but if if they're going to go by these properties that I can see uh on the south side there's there's quite there's a few of them that are very small.

Yep. And so would the bike lane be in the road or would they try to expand the shoulder to do it or what would they try to do?

This is this is one of the the pinch point areas that the project teams has discussed. [clears throat] The corridor itself hasn't even been surveyed yet. So that we're not even working towards the design aspect of it. But, um, yeah, I mean it it's something to consider. Should it be completely off-road cuz the intent is to have a separated um shared use path that is not a bike lane, right?

That is, you know, that could have someone pull into the the shoulder. you know, it's supposed to be curved and like uh you know, like the the one um the Quashian River Rail Trail supposed to be separated from the road like that.

That's the approach. There may be situations like this where you can't fit can't do that and you may have to have an on-road treatment in those kinds of situations.

Or maybe it's not that there's not enough road space, but there may be historical features that you may want to avoid. um and see more value in, you know, avoiding the stone walls or whatever may what whatever obstruction there may be, you may need to route it out into the road. Um again, we're just not into the design phase yet. And the the other issue with big trucks going down there to avoid 195 or six.

Um, is it possible that we could talk with the U, you go to the JPG, whatever it's called, the JTPG. Yep. Okay.

Is it possible to get that road declared? No big trucks. No, no, no vehicles over a certain size or more stops.

A lot of construction.

There's a lot of construction going on like Blossom Road and Dartmouth and stuff. So, they're all coming, you know, but they they don't have to travel the whole way. I mean, road.

Where are you going to put the uh signs?

I don't like this construction roof.

Yeah.

So, I don't want to stop him from going up by by my phone, but I don't want you don't want people on bikes going into the field.

No, I also lived on old river.

Could you could you come up to the mic?

And could you identify yourself, please?

Henry Samson.

Henry Samson.

Yes.

Uh, I used to live on Old Four River Road.

And [clears throat] my brother lived right next door and his wife always complained about blah blah blah. And I says, "Well, I'm going to fence your wall at your house in because my property went halfway across their line." When it perked, the engineer changed the line. So you just [clears throat] when the lots were made, they were straight back.

When they were finished, came down like this and mine shot halfway across his lot right to this telephone pole. Well, I had a couple of Ready Rock blocks out in my yard.

Girl comes around the corner. She goes right between them. 1,500 lb blocks spun right around. She totaled her car. Well, she left. Thank God.

Two years later, somebody hits the pole, they get killed.

Now, you put a bike path.

And I was thinking when I was looking at the rocks, I says, "If I was out here sitting on the rocks, I'm dead."

Sitting in my yard, I'm dead.

Can you [clears throat] point out? Are you on this map? Uh,

there we go.

All right, keep on going.

We'll get there.

Keep on going.

All right, here we are.

small.

Oh, okay.

Further up old far.

I am okay. Straight a circle. You go by that.

I am right over in here. Right here.

Okay.

is that is Mellow's.

That's me. And this is my brother. Oh, Melo. See? No, right here. That's Melo's.

And it's You come around a curve. The girl didn't take the She didn't straight. She didn't make She didn't take the turn.

She went straight to the blocks into my brother's job.

So I mean it's they're going 50 60 m an hour.

I know. So is this in Westport or Dart?

That's that's not Dart. But but it's going to be the same issue.

But as Tommy's father put it when they widened Old Bedford Road.

Yep.

They're making this a racetrack.

Any car that's going 60 miles an hour, I'm gonna blow his head off.

Now, Tommy's father, was he a little off the wall? Yeah, but he was right on the money on that because everybody I gave a sign to. The first thing they said was, "Slow the traffic down."

Now, it's ironic that I'm giving a sign for no bike path. Slow the traffic down. That's the first thing.

Accidents have happened down Blossom Road where the cops, they might have not been there. They were useless.

Uh, I end up calling a friend who was on the police force and I told him, I says, "Paul, I says, "These officers need to be trained, no gloves, 5:00 at night.

That means stop."

And the guy yelled, was yelling at the woman. I says, "That looked like slow down to me."

So he heard me. I I got a big mouth and I'm not afraid to let him know what I think cuz I'm watching it. And I says, "No gloves." Well, 5 minutes later, he's got gloves on and but it's when the car hit the pole, I left my phone on the table cuz I was having dinner. I said, "They're not going anywhere."

That if somebody was on a bike, they'd be history.

that there's Well, we have we have uh we have existing issues with with bicycles and cars.

Um especially on the routes that they take uh down in my neighborhood uh on Burton Road and Old Harbor Road and groups coming with bicycles come with big groups. I mean they they're riding five to six a breast um up and down the road. You can't get by them. They don't fall over. And I think there has to be also some kind of education for these groups that come with all the bicycles. And I if this

becomes the bicycle way, I can see the same thing happening on this route because it's it's in the it's in the country. People going to want to ride it.

No, there'd be a dedicated path in this in this case, though. And when you have the the roads narrowed, [clears throat] that will influence slower speeds. As you had said, when they opened it up, treated it like a a racetrack. And you see the same sort of dynamic on route six where speed limit may be 45 miles an hour, but you know, people are going, you got people going 65 on Old Veter.

Yeah. Right.

It's a straight, as Tommy put, he says, it's it's a racetrack.

Mhm.

and he says somebody backs out your history.

Mhm. Yeah. So, I think it would be in all users interest speeds to to come down.

We have a harvester.

Mhm.

Yeah. We have a potato field down on Stanford Road.

Mhm.

Well, the hops that takes up the whole road.

Yeah. Okay.

Uh I'll block the traffic off right by the church.

And one woman, she says, "I got to get by." I said, "You're not going anywhere."

I says, "Unless you run me over, because you want to hit my truck, go ahead."

Mhm.

But you're not getting by unless you want to go into the field and get stuck in the mud.

I made it so she couldn't get by. Well, she until she sees the harvester come around the corner. Well, the whole road's taken.

She couldn't get by.

The minute it pulled in, she's by.

Mhm.

But it's a safety thing. I don't want the harvester ruins. I don't want her hurt her.

Uh you do what you can.

Mhm.

When we take our take our irrigation that takes up 12 ft.

Uh, it's a right to farm community.

I didn't know we became a place for bike riding is a priority.

Get all the streets that go off of 88 right to farm.

Mhm.

we might as well take them down if this is going to be the case or have all of you sign a paper stating that we're not liable if anybody gets killed.

I mean, that's as I put it to somebody. I said, I've cleaned enough that dead coxes up off the road.

Uh, they put a bike path in. Now, I'm just going to have to go to Mid City.

You're going to have to what?

Go to Mid City with the bike because that's going to be junk. I don't want it.

Do you see? I mean, everywhere I drive in Westport, there's a million people on bikes. Do you see? And I see people on bikes, but the other day I'm going up the road and just like you were saying, they're right across the road.

three children.

One in the left hand lane, he said it east. One between the yellow lines, he said it east. One in the middle of my lane, he's headed east.

I slow down. I stay 300 y behind me because I don't know where they're going to go.

Uh, but you don't think bikes.

Wait a minute.

I'm thinking Brooklyn's a life path where they're taking the whole damn road.

Like you said, there should be some education.

They should be following the laws.

There are laws on the book and they're not there for No, you're right.

They're not there just you have to follow uh like your car.

All right. my little walk.

Yeah.

Uh woman up the road was going 65 m an hour. He pulls her over. Well, I just go up there every week for coffee. Well, she told me, she says, "I got a ticket."

I said, "Well, I saw a car stopped up there." I says, I said to her, I says, "You want it fixed?" "No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no." Well, following year, my brother's going down the road 25 m an hour.

And he says, "Tell your brother to speed up. The speed lie limit is 40."

I said to him, I says, "Paul."

Mrs. Grant was going 65. You gave her a ticket.

You didn't tell her to slow down. You didn't tell her to speed up. you gave her a ticket. And he just looked at me like, "How the hell do you know that?"

Well, I talked to everybody that you stay informed so that when you can Oh, like I said, he's the one I called to when had the accident road in Blossom Road. Record came, he couldn't turn around.

And it was it was a nightmare.

But I felt bad for the driver.

And that's why I called him and said, I said, "Look, I says, "The cops need to be trained how to deal with the situation." Cuz one truck went flying by 40 m an hour. And I said to him, I says, "If it was me, I would hop to my cruiser, go after him, and give him the ticket." [clears throat] Well, we can't do that.

We're in hot water already.

Which would it make sense to have more stop signs on Old Fall River Road, Old Bedford Road?

Yeah.

At any intersection? I mean, you could put one You could put one on Davis Road, but you still got flying 90 m hour.

You got like a mile and a half of straightaway from Mel's Corner to the top of the hill.

Well, you said there there's a lot of traffic on this road because people realize you can get from Fall River and New Bedford without stop signs. So, if that's the case and you put [clears throat] more stop signs, then maybe it discourages people from seeing that as a shortcut.

Probably not. Well, I was just going to say tell my story now.

Probably not. Um they just people don't like to drive through 61.

It's scary. Um but anyways, it's in front of our house. We're p We're way around the corner. Um we're near Blossom Road and we've had quite a few cars in our in our field. They just miss the the end and just end up over the wall or there's some been some pretty good accidents. But our end, we're on the side where it's narrower.

So, a lot of times they pass cuz if somebody's going slow, they pass them.

They pass the double lines and they pass them. People come out of Blossom Road, they look left, they turn right, there's a car coming straight out. We We've There's been some We saw a couple from the intersection on the northern side.

Yeah, they're coming through and it gets weird. Knock on wood, no one's gotten killed, but there's been some very a big trailer, big uh dump truck and a little car. And how he made it around there was amazing because he wouldn't have survived that one. But it's it's just it's it's dangerous. It's a very dangerous road. It's narrow and just to destroy like the people that have worked

their whole life to buy these little house, you know, like it's it's a small line. you're going to take it away from them or and probably what 50% of the people on Old Bedford Road are retired.

So you're you know you're living on fixed incomes and now you've you've got to deal with all all this hoopla.

So uh thank you for all this information.

It's it's it's eye opening to me. Um, and I think that perhaps uh with the um traffic side of Serpent, we could investigate if there's a way to investigate how to uh calm traffic along this road. Serpent is coordinating this project. So, an analysis of speed other speed controls would be in order. Um, and I would imagine that given the feedback that they're receiving about the excessive

speeds, that'll be incorporated.

So, it it's sort of the same problem that we have in Westport. Totally. I mean, we have it's these long straight roads that go between the water bodies and people just go. Um, it's it is amazing. We we don't have as many fatalities.

People that are going to lose their house maybe or property just because of trying to move. Well, everybody's wells are in their front yard and you're just you're just wiping out. Plus, we've got histo I mean a lot of 200 plus houses and walls and everything else that you're going to destroy.

So, I've seen a bad accident similar to what you're talking about on Division Road. Um, they came up to the intersection of Hicksbridge Road and didn't stop and went right across into the field.

Just incredible. I mean, but there are stop signs there.

There's a stop sign.

Yeah.

Which All right. Thank you. put the stop sign. Well, wait a minute.

It stops.

Wait a minute. I'm just saying he still went right through.

Right.

Vlog there was a stop sign.

They went right through. Hit the telephone pole.

It's not going to stop everybody. But it stops a lot of people from doing that.

But when it when he hit the when they hit the pole, somebody asked me that. He says, "You got your phone?" I says, "No, they're not going anywhere."

Because the bang was so hard. crisis.

He's not moving.

Mr. Chair, Michael, u I have a question on what is what is this status?

Who who is the proponent and what is the status of this planning for this bike trail?

The proponent was the South K Coast Bikeway Alliance and they've contracted with Serpent to help administer the grant and PAR Corporation to work on a conceptual design.

So they're they're under contract on a mass trails grant right now to develop the design the they're currently working through the surveying and initial inputs into the design or the initial inputs that will go into the design process.

But they would have no eminent domain authority, right? They're working with the bike committees. Uh here it's the bike walking path committee in Westport.

They're working with the bike committee in Dartmouth and New Bedford. Then they will would go forth and make recommendations to the applicable um decision-m bodies on how to p how to move forward on the design process. So they would go to a select board uh in Westport. they go to select board and present the results of the study and advocate for the next steps whatever that next steps end up being in in the process.

I just got one more question. This is supposed to be a bike walkway.

Uh I live on Boston Road or on Boston.

Have I walked up to Fall River? Yes.

When criminals was there I did.

Did I ever dream of walking to a benefit? Never.

Why could spend a million dollars versus the fellow who did much more than a million dollars?

Well, I'm just I'm being Yeah, there's there's a larger vision of having a connection from Providence to the East Bay Path. um and then beyond to through the south coast of Massachusetts up into Cape Cod and into Province Town.

And not everyone is going to use those paths, but there additional places to recreate in those communities.

So, Mr. chair. Um, I haven't uh looked at the history of road development, but I'm guessing from the shape of the road and the names of the road, Old Bedford Road, Old Fall River Road, that that's the first road that connected New Bedford and Fall River.

Fall River.

And then when people wanted to go faster, they built Route Six. And then when people wanted to go faster, they built 195.

But the oldest road I was not designed for people going 50 m an hour. If you want to go 65 m Yeah. Of course.

Exactly.

If you want to go 65 m an hour, you get on 195. That's designed for 65 m an hour. Old Bedford Road isn't.

Old Fall River Road, old Planefield Road. the series of roads that connected like Russell's Mills road that connected Bliss Corner to Russell's Mills. Uh and so as you heard us talk about the head of Westport and how you slow people down on a old county road, uh this seems to be a related problem. I I just don't think that farms and bicycles and walking are uh in congruous uh because I see a lot of

people enjoying themselves walking and bicycling by farms and but it it's hard to do if you've got people going 60 miles an hour on a road that's designed to go 30 miles an hour. So, I don't think the answer is to get rid of bikes.

I think the answer is these roads you should be going 25 or 30 m an hour, not 60. Now, people violate stop sign uh stop signs. They violate speed limits.

But that's why you have police and uh to to get people to adhere to those laws.

Police do.

What do they do? You get enough tickets, you you slow down.

Wait a minute. If you get enough tickets, how many tickets have they handed out?

I don't know. But I'm saying there ought to be a way to none that you can slow people down on a road like this.

You got the whole reservation cop and stuff. It's all gorgeous that you could put put you could bypass all that and go right through there, get into Dartmouth, get in, you know, without disrupting.

And a lot of the houses because they're old farm farm, they're built near the road because you're I know. But what you've spent a half an hour or so describing is the problem of people driving cars, not bicycles 60 m an hour and driving through rocks and driving through telephone calls. They're not on bicycles. They're in cars going 60 mph on a road that's not designed to to travel 60 m an hour.

But the road was designed to go 60 m.

Now road.

When they widen the road, we gave 10 ft.

We had to give 10 ft.

I see.

Yeah.

This is way back when Russell Davis was the Russell Davis, the engineer. hot and uh he was a highway engineer and we told him he said we want the top soil and he said I can't guarantee it unless you take it. So Tommy's father took out the 10 ft. That's how I know how much they got.

And I said they're not going to give it to us. We have to pay the guy to take it out. We should go down a fork to take more out.

I'm going to put a foot back in to pay for our for him.

So So Oh, wait a minute. But my father says, "No, no, no. That's not right." I said, "No, you're right.

But it's not right for them to make a super highway when you've got Route 6 and 195."

I'm agreeing with you on that. I just think the issue is how do you slow people down on old Bedford Road?

There's that and it's more the thing of of what are you going to do with these people their wells that right that's that's the there's two different issues.

There's the issue close to Fall River where the lots are very small and then you have the problem of winding road going through everybody's property almost a lot of cemeteries do has a lot of great on the road has quite a few cemeteries across almost across from each other so it's like you can't touch those so where is the bike path going to go Old Bend Road, Los Sanford Road.

Goes to Sanford Road.

Okay. So, it's going to go on the east side of Sand Road.

That hasn't been determined.

That's not true.

That hasn't been determined.

You got this much room between the cemetery and the road.

I'm just saying that there's no design hasn't been determined. So, I can't tell you the highway department.

I mentioned it to him and he said cemeteries can't be touched.

Maryanne kind of screwed around.

There's this much room for sidewalk before us.

No. So, so I mean it's either they're going to be going from one side of the road to the other and underneath 195.

But we're not proposing this.

No. So, yeah, Bob is right. We're not proposing this. We're not getting a report.

I'm just put I look at it. I want you to have what we know.

And thank you for telling us cuz I think because it's something that you can say, "Okay, yeah, we put it right there. No problem."

But there's a house up the road. Uh it's a postage stamp. It's not even a quarter of an acre.

Yep. Uh if they go on that side of the road, uh you have nothing.

Yeah. I I I can't imagine them doing a taking that would make those lots smaller.

I just can't imagine that. But we're not here to discuss that.

Yeah. We're just here to hear where we are in the preliminary process.

So well, the the town's uh involve the one that I'm discussing is is right here.

Right. That's the only thing that the only thing that's we're doing is that piece that's connects to Fall River.

Yeah. Phoenix that was behind it's in it's in the it's it's actually in South Puppa Pond.

Well, it's runs along the railroad tracks run along.

Yeah. Runs right on top of the old railroad tracks. Right.

[clears throat] And it's on the water side of all those buildings.

But now that's Westport.

That's Westport, right?

Well, part of it is in the line, right?

So that's all we're talking about and where it goes from there. And if ever goes anywhere, it's not before us. So I think uh but thank you all for for but why I asked where it's going to go is if it goes all that group it goes between whites and Hampton in Yep.

which Donald Francis is kind of like that which is I think he's fine with that. Who's done?

I have another meeting. Thank you very much. Now, as far as Old Bedford Road, that's not even like they may come up with another plan, another route or is that like we need to do this? That was they have kind of coalesed on using Old Bedford Road as the cross, Westport, Dartmouth, New Bedford. But is there another if this doesn't work is there did they have another plan? I I talked

to Steve who said there there's like four scenarios. So I don't know what the they had the South Coast Bikeway Alliance had a couple different scenarios that they were considering in the past. The scenario that they have decided to move forward with in consultation with each town was the old Bedford routing. But what we're working on just as the planning board is just this this piece here.

Um, and that's something we've been spearheading as a board is to get finish this connection into town.

Well, that's just by that in the railroad track from the railroad cuz rail rooms.

You can't buy it from the railroad.

No, you can't.

No, you can't. They won't. You can't.

Trust me.

I did the paper.

Thank you very much. Yes, sir. I appreciate it. I'll talk to you later.

Okay.

Uh, Michael, please continue. I'm sorry I interrupted.

That's okay.

Uh, the village center zoning project.

They talked about this in relation to um the head of Westport, but that will be underway with some public engagement at the harvest festival this fall. And they've also been at the farmers market.

So, um, we'll have some more updates on that once they get out. They, meaning the regional planning agency. Um, and then with the Route Six neighborhood plan, I'm finalizing that with comments from town boards, departments, committees. is I sent a draft out to the relevant boards and um we'll incorporate them as needed uh and bring the plan to the planning board for endorsement next month

and I'll go into the assistant planners report since Dia is not here. Um, regarding Francis Estates, there's a report in your packets indicating that the drainage is being completed. It's uh the drainage basins, the uh pocket wetland are being constructed right now and they have also started installation of the electrical utilities at the Herring Run Farms. the consulting engineer went out and um did

materials testing of the gravel base and they the material that was placed on the Herring um roadway was the appropriate materials and then with Bentley Estates, the consulting engineer was out there I think two weeks ago to witness witnessed the paving of the sidewalks on Whan Way and they sent asphalt mixtures to the laboratory for testing. The last thing they need to do is put the top coat on

the road and then we'll get an AS belt to review and that one will be closed out.

Been a long time.

It's been 15 years I think.

So, it was Bentley Estates. They're they're putting the sidewalks in.

The sidewalks went in already.

I think the top coat may have gone down on the roadway already. I I haven't been out there in a couple weeks. Uh, but I believe Bob Kory told me that the top coat was either about to go down or it has gone down. And so Derek is always on site to witness um that so he can get a sample of the material and get it sent out for for testing.

Okay.

So can I go backwards a bit and go to the village center zoning project? Okay.

Yep.

So um the village that we're talking about first is the head of Westport, right?

Or any village.

We can talk about any of them. um the it's the the head of Westport, Adamsville, Central Village, and kind of a the point and by extension across the river to Tripsville Yard and some of the adjacent properties for kind of a marine servicesbased land use consideration. Yeah.

Okay.

So that's the planners and assistant planner supports are done.

Yeah, we can move on the minutes. So u now the minutes of July 14th.

Mr. chair. Uh I've read the July 14th minutes. I think they're uh very good and complete and accurate. So I would approve the minutes of uh we have uh confused now. I've read the minutes of July 14th.

Say again.

It should be August 2.

All right. So, both here.

What I have in front of me is July 14th.

So, just table it to the next.

Yeah.

Have we already approved July 14th?

Yeah.

Okay. So, we don't have 25th.

That's why I didn't find any mistakes.

No, I think I didn't change the date on the top.

I copied it over. Yeah, I cuz when I read it, I thought this was the last meeting we had.

Yeah, I probably didn't change the Yeah, it's I mean this is Gnome Surf.

This is our last meeting. So, I think the only error is that date.

I think this is August 25th. And then uh I would move approval of uh the August 25th minutes as long as the date and time of the meeting are changed to from July 14th to August 25th.

Otherwise, I think they are accurate.

I I second that motion.

All those in favor?

I I thank you. they need uh next would be to discuss uh perspective 2026 zoning amendments for town meeting of next year.

So, I understand that the board in the meeting where I was on vacation scheduled a work session in November.

And in preparation for that, I would like to just take a general call for any zoning amendments that you'd like to be considered or things that have come up in previous cases that you made a mental note that you'd like to have addressed.

Um, I have a couple of couple here where we need to rework the minimum front yard width because that has caused some confusion with the way that it's written. Um, whether or not the minimum front yard width needs to be carried to the front of the structure or if it's just the front yard area. Um, so we'll rework that section of the zoning bylaw. Um, [clears throat] I have heard some

discussion about putting some potential parameters or prohibitions around construction of data centers.

And we need a definition for inclusionary housing in the zoning bylaw.

And then there are changes from the signed budget bill as well as the economic development budget or the economic development bill that's currently going through reconciliation that will likely result in changes to the zoning act. And if it is passed in time, we may need to modify our zoning bylaw based on those changes.

I'll keep a breast of that, but And I think we also want to do some village zoning, right?

Yes.

For at least for the head westport and think about others. Um yeah, certainly something. Um I'm not sure where we're going to if we're going to be in a place where there will be a full-fledged new village commercial district, but we could do something similar to what was done with Adamsville last year. And I think coming on the heels of the Route Six plan, we could get some zoning articles out there that

would be an incremental change to the existing zoning. kind of taking the same approach that we're doing for the village centers, looking at what the parcel sizes are, um where there are where there's uh making making amendments where there are smaller parcels and higher residential densities um due to the way that those areas historically developed. So right sizing that zoning in in a couple different

areas and just throwing that out at town meeting and seeing how people react to to that.

Yeah. And so, um, with the Route 6, uh, plan, um, I I think it would be appropriate to try out our form based zoning ideas in that area uh, for both residential and for commercial.

Um, and I don't know how how far off of Route 6 to include that endeavor, but I think you have to figure that out.

Should it go with the same commercial area or, you know, is the residential area a much bigger section? It could be um especially when there's existing smaller lots Mhm.

and structure uh that might accommodate um make it easier for people to use their land out there.

Mhm.

Mhm.

Especially if you're going to get water.

I mean, that's that's one of the big things.

Yes, sir.

Uh Mr. Mr. Chair, I agree with you on uh trying to look at uh form based uh zoning.

I think that and I'm not an expert in this um but I've been following it in New Bedford uh where they've adopted it. Um, and you think that the modern zoning is really for a a Route Six kind of environment with large setbacks, lot of big sideyards and everything else in it. And in the parts of Route 6 that are uh commercial, that's appropriate. Route 6 used to have

lots of houses on it as well as you know. Uh but I think that uh what I see as the advantage of formbbased zoning is especially when you're in either parts of Route 6 or you know the head of Westport or Westport Point or historic villages where you don't get uh big setbacks. uh you don't get big sideyards, you don't get big lots, but everyone looks at it and says, "This is fine. This is beautiful. We

want to keep this." And so to to design a zoning that says that is actually permittable if you are fitting in with the neighborhood and building something you know the same scale the same setback uh as the rest of the neighborhood that's preferable in saying we want uh Westport Point to look like Route 6. Uh and so I think uh putting together a formbbased zoning for a number of districts

um I don't know whether it will be met with public support or not but I think it's a a direction we ought to go because I think most people look at the older parts of town and say yeah this is what we want to protect and so the zoning shouldn't work against you on that. So I hope we do develop something like that in different uh areas. the farm based zoning lends itself to a more

incremental approach of development.

Whereas our the zoning code as it stands now pretty much presupposes that you're going to have big box style development because you with the way the land areas are and the setback requirements are, you have to assemble multiple parcels together in order to make the development happen. and then you're going to maximize the building footprint on there and get return on your investment. And so,

um, yeah, I think the the formbbased approach makes a lot of sense because that underscores what we're trying to do here, which is not have huge change, but allow for things.

Can we do that in time for the next town meeting?

We can work on We can work on it. Yeah.

I I don't know if we'll be able to have it for all of the area village areas. Um but we're working on that aspect with sered and we can start advancing some of the ground six stuff too.

Is there a location where a pilot might be in order kind of like we did with Adamsville? Adam still like is there a area an area what an old historic or older village with small lots that would be beneficial for us to study and try central village central village or somewhere where we can try it and see absolutely I think that would be all we got at once we have to learn our way

exactly and I think the town would be more admittable to a change like this if we did it in small incremental steps then just dumped it on their lap and say we're going to go from you know two zones or three zones to 16 zones and here's what we're like I don't this this town the change change doesn't work so I think we just need to be very small and and thoughtful about what we

propose and put forth and as a pilot and as we would grow it. So I would think hopefully maybe in next since we got Adamsville kind of rolling on that on that on that we could look to expand that into some additional village centers to kind of include that in as well. So showing that the town that we're being we're making steps forward, trying to make improvements, but also growing within our means and not trying

to take on more than we can actually accomplish on an annual basis because I think that gets that gets back to the town people. Where do you end up with?

And the other part of the form base that I'm not sure belongs in form base but is uh having a formb table of use so that we don't have to iterate every possible use under this earth to say this is allowed that's not allowed. It should be ranked in um impact on the town in the neighborhood as opposed to case making or firearms whatever they're doing like manufacturing. I mean that right can

Michael do you think that as we put together this form base that the language in the zoning uh would be the same no matter what area you're talking about and then it's what boundaries do you draw for that single description of form base used to apply so you look at a boundary around head of westport Or do you look at a boundary around Central Village? I mean, these have boundaries anyway, but you're

not inventing a new zoning for each of those districts, right? It it would be form-based zoning with the standard language in there that would then be applied to Adamsville to the different places where it makes sense. Yeah, I think you can apply it in multiple places with I think Central Village is going to be a standout just because it's a little bit different.

It's a lot more there's a lot more intensity of use through here. So what you have in Central Village I think will look different than Adamsville at the head of Westport. But um yeah, I mean you could have like a we used we called it village commercial in Adamsville and maybe we can take that over and apply it to the head of Westport for example and just define the geography of that district.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I can see that central village may be different than the other villers and the marine one you mentioned.

Yeah.

Yeah. the marine the dealing with the Yeah, that it's entire thing its own thing. Yeah, it it it seems to me that that we we could we could we could form these village districts and by by a boundary and say within this boundary the formbbased zoning applies.

Um right and and then that that's one approach or then you say or the other approach is you could still use form based zoning but for instance I I I think of what what the point looks like and and particularly if you if you you take the marine uses at the end of the point Mhm.

And and do we need to distinguish that from the head village? you know, and somehow say that, you know, there's there's something unique about that. Oh, we chop the the waterfront out of the head out of the village, out of the point district and say it's it matches, you know, across the road in in trips and everything. It matches across the the the harbor, right? and say, "Okay, well, there

there's a there is a marine district that that is is different in character."

I have a separate Sure. topic. Uh Michael, you mentioned one of the issues uh that was brought up, it may have been me, is uh data centers and uh I know I inquired of you and Dia whether uh data centers as we understand them are uh allowed in the table of use and my memory may be incorrect but I think it was uh in the um science technology district and Route six, they're allowed,

but not the rest of Westport.

And um if I'm wrong about that, correct me. Um I I think we should consider uh whether they data centers uh we'd have to define them uh not not be allowed there either. Um and the main reason uh for that is um that so far they seem to require enormous amounts of electricity.

The solar farms and everything we've permitted create electricity. These things suck it up. Um, and they don't generate a huge number of jobs once you get past construction.

And um, until they learn how to recycle water, these people are all supposed to be really smart, but they're using an awful lot of water for cooling uh, which seems stupid to me. But, uh, we don't have a lot of water. Uh even if we tie in to Fall River, that's I remember when I was mayor, Goodyear and New Bedford used a million gallons a day because uh they ran it through to cool their

machines and then put it into the sewer pipe and then we were treating in a sewer plant fresh water that you could drink. And I I said to the Goodyear guy, "Have you ever thought of recycling your water?" You know, and he said, "Well, we don't want to pay for it." So we frontloaded his water use fee, lent him whatever it was a million bucks, he'd put it in and he cut his water use by

90%. Just by recycling and it also meant we weren't treating fresh water, drinkable water. So uh these guys seem to be pretty wasteful of water. Um and uh I just uh wonder that this whole topic of you know AI and data centers is going at warp speed and it if you don't get ahead of it you can get run over by it. Maybe you get run over and it's a

good thing. Maybe you get run over and it's not a good thing. But I don't see how data centers help.

You are correct. the only place you can develop a data center under the zoning bylaw right now is the science and technology overlay district.

So, it's a pretty limited area um that has some pretty challenging access issues geographically. It's very difficult, right?

The the question about a data center there Mhm. would be if they're using a lot of water, which may help us get a cheaper water price for everybody in Westport.

Where does all the water go?

Mhm.

Yep.

Yeah. I don't I don't know.

I mean, we have no place to put it. I mean, I think that was included in the science and technology table of use before these kind of gigantic data centers were Oh, yeah.

Absolutely. More for just a regular place.

Yeah. Not not before we could the the scale of data centers massive right I mean it's like fullon warehousing for data processing and that I don't think the board really conceptualized of 15 years ago when the science and technology overlay district was adopted some AI senses are the size of a district Right.

I don't mean they fit inside the district. They are they are the size of the district. They're hundreds of acres.

So anyway, I think that would be one thing that we need to address from the table of views.

Yeah, we can do that.

So, we're going to go over all these things in more detail at the work session.

In the work session, I'll probably add it on to a couple more agendas. Yeah.

Um, I I asked the zoning board of appeals and the building inspector to let me know if there's anything that they've come across. So, as those issues come up, I'll keep bringing them to you all um so we can continue the discussion and we're not having a massive things that we're all getting up to speed on in.

Okay. So, any more ideas for this before we close it up? Can I ask a question?

Yes, sir.

Um, these places use a lot of water.

It's like when if these places use a lot of water.

Yeah.

It's like when you build a house, you don't get a building until you have a well and septic system.

Yep.

Uh, you're not going to build this thing if you don't have the water.

Well, they can get water from Fall River. Uh we have the water pipe already coming from Fall River down part of Route Six. Uh if they use that um I think they would have the right if it went by their property they'd have the right to tie in. But the question is if it uses a lot of water once they're done with it where does it go?

And we don't have the capacity for a million gallons of storm water. There's no water and no sewer.

Um, and as John was talking about, if it's clean water, you don't want to put it in the sewer system.

There's no place for it to go. I can't imagine at some point they should have just like with manure tanks that they have on uh a place where they can store it. Oh, great point. They built that huge tower so the water warm water wouldn't go back into the river.

You're right.

Uh it's gone.

Hundreds of millions of dollars.

Yeah.

So anyway, that's not That's why I say it's something that you got. So before you go and build an airport, [clears throat] you need the acreage to get to the land.

Well, there is area in in the science and technology overlay district that could be used for this purpose and that's why we're talking about removing it from our table of use so it doesn't happen.

Anyway, uh thank you. U anybody else for anything?

You want a motion to adjurnn?

Please move we adjourn.

Second. All those in favor. I I thank you.